|
Jobs and Career Management in the Financial Markets, Banking & Finance |
|
| Job Seekers Sign in / Register |
Recruiter's Sign-in
|
| Careers Home | My eFinancialCareers | Find a Job | Post Resume |
Search by Company |
News & Advice |
Search Resumes |
Post a Job
|
TOP STORIES
The new, new prop traders
20 October 2009By Sarah Butcher
COMMENTS
It just goes to show you that senior bankers still don't understand the workings of their own front office activities. Read all comments »As we mentioned last week, prop traders appear to be rising up the desirability ranks, despite the fact that UBS, Deutsche, Calyon and JP Morgan have either killed off or partially dismembered their prop trading desks. However, the new prop traders may well be different to the old ones.
In his interview with the Financial Times this week, Barclays chairman Marcus Agius said the bank’s still doing prop trading, but it’s not doing prop trading the way it did before.
According to the FT (which we assume got its information from Agius), Barclays no longer ‘operates dedicated proprietary trading teams, but its traders frequently take positions on the bank’s behalf alongside the “flow business” they are doing on behalf of clients.’
This being the case, some of the skill seems to have gone out of the prop traders’ art. And with traders now dependent on flows, surely some of the rewards have gone too.
Simon Maughan, a banking analyst at brokerage firm MF Global, says it’s all prop trading to him, but that the new version of prop trading is definitely less demanding than the old one: “All you need to do is sit on the desk and watch the flows – it’s just a question of copying what your more intelligent clients are doing.”
With investment decisions largely dictated by client flows, Ralph Silva, a research director at the Tower Group, says the new prop trading is mostly about best execution. Nevertheless, he says many of the old school prop traders are moving into it for want of anything better to do.
“I had a friend who was managing €3.3bn a day for a European bank,” says Silva. “Now that bank’s got no money and he would be managing a fraction of that.” He adds that this particular person hasn’t reinvented himself as a new-style prop trader, but is currently sitting on a beach in Australia.
COMMENTS
Doh, Consultancy, Tue 20 Oct 09
prop trading....sound more like front running and insider trading to me...this time it will be easier for the SEC they can just use the trading desk tapes ala raj :-)
Add your comment »John, Hedge Funds, Tue 20 Oct 09
Hmmmm!!
1/ Old guard prop traders also watch the flow.
2/ "Replicating your more intelligent clients strategy ". Impossible. Accuracy & returns will be biased. Should the client be trad Asset Mgt firm, allocation is for mid to long term, not for prop purposes. No buy-side firm is stupid enough to disclose all its holdings/weights to 1 single broker/ sales to let a trader eventually working out the portfolio structure regardless of their historical excellent working relationships.
3/ Apply point 2 ahead of your client & you’re front running him with all the fun consequences coming with it.
4/ Derivatives hedges initated by an Asset Mgt firm aren't replicable if you don't know precisely what their underlying portfolios structure are.
5 / Consequently: new new prop traders don’t exist. Pure fantasy. Either you are flow (starting shaving & thinking you rule the world due to your oxbridge degree) & play around with client contrib as it has been the case for donkeys years according to your discretionary limits, either you run an internal hedge fund & superhead risk & compliance depts and smoke big fat Cohibas with the global head of Trading to smooth your deals when required.
John, Hedge Funds, Tue 20 Oct 09
6/ I don't see much difference as far as global balance sheet risk is concerned for banks who externalised their prop groups to various newly created Hedge Fund entities .....and funding those !
Add your comment »CK, HR & Recruitment, Wed 21 Oct 09
I think the term 'prop trader' has been misused over the years and certainly does not refer to any link with flows, other than on a technical basis.
The whole idea of prop trading was to let senior traders look at the market as a whole and invest money accordingly with their own ideas.
Flow trading has its own place and relies on a totally different skill set.
It just goes to show you that senior bankers still don't understand the workings of their own front office activities.


